[b-greek] Re: question about James 4:1-2

From: Harold R. Holmyard III (hholmyard@ont.com)
Date: Thu Nov 23 2000 - 21:11:25 EST

Dear Rob,

I incline to the specific sense of "members" in Jas 4:1 referring to
members of the body, because there is no nearby reference to church
membership and because the NT uses "members" to refers to parts of the
human body.

I am not sympathetic to Robertson's rendering of 4:2 for the reason you
give, and also for the parallelism that the UBS division brings out:

You desire and do not have; you kill and are jealous and are not able to
obtain; you fight and war. You do not have because you do not ask; you ask
and do not receive because you ask wrongly, that you might spend it on your

                                Harold Holmyard

>The question here is one of punctuation. Robertson, in his "word Pictures
>in the New Testament" likes to translate the first portion something like
>this (at least this is my understanding)
>"You lust, and you do not have, so you murder. You covet and cannot
>obtain, and (as a result) you fight and war."
>This follows closely with my NASB, and it is similar to the NRSV, regarding
>punctuation -- however, the puntuation in the UBS GNT is not like this, and
>to translate it with their punctuation would get a little different sense.
>It would seem that PHONEUETE is connected to ZHLOUTE and so on by the KAI
>(is KAI not a coordinating conjuntion?) so I wonder how to connect it to
>the first part -- also, the translation in English seems a little odd to
>connect PHONEUETE to the first part -- e.g.
>"You lust and do not have; so you commit murder. And you are envious and
>cannot obtain..."
>Note the second sentence, "And you are envious..." I always considered it
>to be poor English grammar usage to begin a sentence with an "And." My
>problem is that this passage is part of my sermon for this week, and my
>congregation reads out of the King James version -- there is a fair
>difference between what I would like to say about this passage (I like the
>view Robertson holds) and what their Bibles say -- I am afraid to bring
>this up, as there could be confusion. Above all, I don't think it is a good
>idea to go into my church and not have an answer for them. At school it is
>good to discuss different opinions and ideas, but I have a feeling that
>would be harmful at church. At any rate, if anyone can help me sort this
>out (I hope you all understand what I am asking) I would appreciate it
>muchly. Thanks
>Rob Somers
>Did you know that the banana is the
>atheist's worst nightmare?
>Find out why by clicking on the
>"Atheist Test" at
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