Mike;
You're on the right track I think.
I have never used a "biological" product that has worked within my wheat
farming system, whether it be a fungicide or a herbicide, that has stopped a
fungus or a bacterial attack in its tracks. Granted there are biological
interventions that have proven themselves, and new ones in the pipeline, to
combat lopers and/or bollworms that are promising.
Best results have come from compost in my opinion. Or any systems that have
increased the organic content of the soil. Or any practices that have
developed in conjunction with soil organic improvements.
Then again, most of the products we seem to use in the normal course of
production are biocides. They destroy biology.
SS
From: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com [mailto:compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of mikethewormguy
Sent: 31 March 2011 14:03
To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [compost_tea] Re: Best Environmental Technologies?
Stephen,
I think that it would have been better for me to say that products need to
be tested/evaluated objectively with the proper experimental design. This
could be at the farmer's location and/or at a 3rd party located.
One thing I have sought to do with 'organic' formulation(s) testing is to
really be clear on what 'success' looks like and conditions connected to
creating 'success'. It is a challenge and sorry to say, at times, location
specific.
Mike Flynn
Green Quest LLC
BioSoecific LLC
--- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Stephen Steyn" <ssteyn_at_...> wrote:
>
> Well Mike:
>
> For want of repeatable results from independent trials what else are we to
> do? So, for the product formulators on the list, get results we can rely
on
> to reflect the conditions we are supposed to use the product under and
then
> we can evaluate the efficacy of the product.
>
> It is of course equally relevant to ACT, and in my opinion, one of the
> failures of ACT or AACT or even compost, to give results that are
> consistently better than doing nothing. Granted some studies have been
done,
> but nothing definitive.
>
> SS
>
>
>
> From: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com> ]
On
> Behalf Of mikethewormguy
> Sent: 30 March 2011 15:40
> To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [compost_tea] Re: Best Environmental Technologies?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Are we now determining the quality of a soil amendment (i.e. TM21) based
on
> educated guessing ?
>
> Do we want others to apply the seeming 'guessing' standard to ACT or LCE ?
>
> For the product formulators on this list, my sense is that none of us
would
> want our product judged based upon even 'educated' guessing and opinion.
>
> As Elaine would say.... " Where's the data " " Show me the data "
>
> Pardon if I sound a little sensitive, but being a cook with a lab coat who
> makes stuff, the is alot of great stuff that can be formulated into a
'thin
> black liquid".
>
> Mike Flynn
> Green Quest LLC
> BioSpecific LLC
>
> --- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "Tim Wilson" <thegoodjob_at_> wrote:
> >
> > I was going to say; sounds like molasses before anyone mentioned this.
Why
> pay for watered down molasses?
> >
> > Tim
> >
> > --- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
<mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
> , "jwoenne" <jrrwoenne_at_> wrote:
> > >
> > > Julie,
> > >
> > > Thanks for the feedback.
> > >
> > > I agree entirely. I also suspect it some kind of mix of molasses/humic
> acid/fulvic acid/liquid kelp.
> > >
> > > I tried it a few years ago without any visible benefit. I suspect it
> gives visible benefit with soils that have been hammered by poor farming
> practices, i.e., compacted soils with struggling microbiology. But if your
> soils are pretty good to start, then there is little benefit.
> > >
> > > James
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
<mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:compost_tea%40yahoogroups.com> , "firth_julie" <yilgarn_at_> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi James,
> > > > I live in Geraldton, Western Australia and went to a tm21 best
seminar
> a year or so ago and I asked Martin Straper (the presenter and ex csiro
> scientist) what was in it and he said " no micro-organisms, just food to
> stimulate them." The product is a black thin liquid, my guess is it
possibly
> a mix of fulvic acid, molasses, kelp etc...
> > > > The actual ingredients are their trade secrets I suppose, otherwise
> who would buy it when we can make our own..and they have to pay for their
> product, research, marketing etc.. somehow.
> > > >
> > > > Whether it is produces any better results than a liquid bact/and or
> fungal food mix to your soil is something you would have to trial.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps.
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards
> > > > Julie Firth
> > > > Drylands Permaculture Research Farm
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
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Received on Fri Apr 01 2011 - 00:49:40 EDT