[B-Greek] PNEUMA hAGION as a proper name

Blue Meeksbay bluemeeksbay at yahoo.com
Thu May 13 19:31:17 EDT 2010


Hi Eric –
 
JOHN16:13 hOTAN DE ELQHi EKEINOS, TO PNEUMA THS ALHQEIAS, hODHGHSEI hUMAS EN THiALHQEIAi PASHi• OU GAR LALHSEI AF᾽ hEAUTOU, ALL᾽ hOSA AKOUSEI LALHSEI KAI TAERCOMENA ANAGGELEI hUMIN.
 
Thanks for your thoughts. I agree with you that theantecedent is the masculine PARAKLHTOS, but the point I was trying to make was that the masculine pronoun EKEINOSwas linked with the neuter PNEUMA that was in apposition in John 16:13. Or probably, it would be more correct to say the neuter PNEUMA is linked with the masculine pronoun EKEINOS.  Because of the link, I gave other examples of EKEINOS.
 
As Smyth says, *An appositive is a noun added to another noun or to a pronoun to describe or define it.* (916). It seems we have the same pattern in John 14:26, whereas instead of TO PNEUMA THS ALHQEIAS in apposition we have TO PNEUMA TO hAGION in apposition. However, this time it is not in apposition to EKEINOS but to PARAKLHTOS. Also notice his use of EKEINOS later in the verse.
 
JOHN 14:26 hO DE PARAKLHTOS, TO PNEUMA TO hAGION, hO PEMYEI hO PATHR EN TWi ONOMATI MOU, EKEINOS hUMAS DIDAXEI PANTA KAI hUPOMNHSEI hUMAS PANTA hA EIPON hUMIN [EGW]. 
 
I looked up Robertson (709) and he states, *Cf. hO in Jo. 14:17,26 and AUTO in 14:17.* in reference to this constructionin 16:13,(having already concluded that the *grammatical gender so easily called for EKEINO* in 16:13).  He also believes John is making a point by his use of EKEINOS.
 
So there is Robertson’s opinion added to the mix. As I said before, many of us have different opinions. I guess everyone will have to decide for themselves.
 
Sincerely,
Blue Harris




________________________________
From: Eric S. Weiss <papaweiss1 at yahoo.com>
To: b-greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Thu, May 13, 2010 1:24:21 PM
Subject: [B-Greek] PNEUMA hAGION as a proper name

> Blue Meeksbay wrote: 
> 
> When we do this I think it is reasonable to see what the writer of the Gospel of John believed regarding the Holy 
> Spirit. I think one will see he believed the Spirit was more than just an influence or function, but understood him as a 
> Person..
> 
> JOHN 16:13 hOTAN DE ELQHi EKEINOS, TO PNEUMA THS ALHQEIAS, hODHGHSEI hUMAS EN THi ALHQEIAi 
> PASHi• OU GAR LALHSEI AF᾽ hEAUTOU, ALL᾽ hOSA AKOUSEI LALHSEI KAI TA ERCOMENA ANAGGELEI 
> hUMIN.
> 
> *But when He comes, the Spirit of Truth…*
> 
> Here we have the masculine pronoun EKEINOSjoined with the neuter PNEUMA in apposition, thereby showing the 
> Spirit is more than just a function, at least in the mind of John. He repeatedly uses EKEINOSas is seen below.
 
Blue Meeksbay:

Having looked at these PNEUMA hAGION passages in GJohn re: the person-ness of the Holy Spirit, I think it can be 
argued/demonstrated that in every instance in which a masculine pronoun is used, the antecedent is the masculine 
PARAKLHTOS and not the neuter PNEUMA. There is I think one verse where it may be a bit of a stretch because of 
the distance between the antecedent and the pronoun, but it's not an unreasonable stretch.

Hence, I don't think one can argue from GJohn that the author used the masculine pronoun EKEINOS for a neuter noun 
PNEUMA to indicate the Person Being-ness of the PNEUMA hAGION, because he in fact did not use EKEINOS for 
PNEUMA, but for PARAKLHTOS.
 
- - -
Eric S. Weiss 


      
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