Dear Sri Vishnu, I think we may getting lost in the words here. If you separate sEshatvam as servitude only and pAratantryam as complete dependence, then, were a situation to arise where, for His pleasure, He wishes to reverse the sEsha sEshi bhAvam between us and Him, then pAratantryam would dictate that we accept that. Hence the difference between Lakshmana who refused to give up direct service to Rama and Bharata who accepted Rama's words. If we take it that pAratantryam is the height of sEshatvam, then you are right - we cannot say that pAratantrayam allows us to remove sEshatvam. Therefore, you could make the case that Bharata did not give up service to Rama; he was still performing service to Him by obeying His words. The point here though is that the jIvAtma cannot hold on to its nature of sEsha and feel that that position cannot be changed. A paratantra accepts even the destruction of his sEsha bhAvam if He so desires. This is what sutra 92 states. As examples, Manavala Mamunigal accepting the position of being an acharya to the Lord Himself - purely for His pleasure; and Nammazhvar allowing the Lord to even massage his feet - again for His pleasure. adiyEn madhurakavi dAsan --- Vishnu <vsmvishnu@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Dear Sriman Venkatesan, > > I agree with Sriman Padmanabhan on this. > > The mUlam quoted by Smt Sheela also does not have any > mention of > SEshatvam specifically. > > SEsham means something which remains (for Him in our > context) and > such nature is SEshatvam. Our AchAryas have derived this > as > subservience, servitude etc., though the English words we > choose may > not be the best fit. This derviation is due to the fact > that nothing > can be superior or equal to Him. > > If we are SEshabhUtam for Him i.e. if we meaningfully > remain for Him, > we should not question whatever He wishes including those > acts that > are seemingly against our SEshatvam. Hence pAratantryam > and SEshatvam > are inter-linked. Thus pAratantryam makes our SEshatvam > complete or > perfect rather than destroying it or even tolerating its > destruction. > > This can be seen in "nivAsa SayyAsana..." SlOka of yAmuna > where SEsha > serves Him as abode, bed, throne, footwear, pillow, > umbrella etc. > Here it is important to note that all the objects > mentioned are > non-sentient, indicating pAratantryam without any > ahankAram. Thus > SEsha has complete SEshatvam. > > Then how do we interpret sUtra 92? > > Dasan > Vishnu > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/.itolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> azhwAr emberumAnAr jeeyAr thiruvadigalE saranam Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ramanuja/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: ramanuja-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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