--- In ramanuja@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, TCA Venkatesan <vtca@xxxx> wrote: > Dear Sri Vishnu, > > I think we may getting lost in the words here. Dear Sriman Venkatesan, Certainly no! If we do not try to understand, why should we disucss:-) > > If you separate sEshatvam as servitude only and > pAratantryam as complete dependence, then, were a > situation to arise where, for His pleasure, He > wishes to reverse the sEsha sEshi bhAvam between > us and Him, then pAratantryam would dictate that > we accept that. Hence the difference between > Lakshmana who refused to give up direct service > to Rama and Bharata who accepted Rama's words. > > If we take it that pAratantryam is the height > of sEshatvam, then you are right - we cannot > say that pAratantrayam allows us to remove > sEshatvam. Therefore, you could make the case > that Bharata did not give up service to Rama; > he was still performing service to Him by obeying > His words. > > The point here though is that the jIvAtma cannot > hold on to its nature of sEsha and feel that that > position cannot be changed. A paratantra accepts > even the destruction of his sEsha bhAvam if He so > desires. This is what sutra 92 states. Exactly that is what I am trying to say. If at all there is some ahankAram associated with SEshatvam (as pointed by Smt Sumithra), pAratantryam destroys that too. This means I am not SEsham for Him on my own, but I remain for Him (SEsham) as He wishes. Thus, there is no ahankAram in perfect SEshatvam, as we remain for Him as He wishes. > > As examples, Manavala Mamunigal accepting the > position of being an acharya to the Lord Himself > - purely for His pleasure; and Nammazhvar allowing > the Lord to even massage his feet - again for His > pleasure. Agreed! Kindly forgive me for any mistakes. dasan vishnu ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/.itolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> azhwAr emberumAnAr jeeyAr thiruvadigalE saranam Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ramanuja/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: ramanuja-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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