[B-Greek] How do you Read Mark 7:2 and 7:3

Carl W. Conrad cwconrad at ioa.com
Fri Jun 10 09:24:31 EDT 2005


On Jun 10, 2005, at 7:56 AM, Richard Richmond wrote:

>
> How do you read?
>
> the translation of these verses has often been the subject of much  
> debate. There are two items in particular that draw attention to  
> these two verses. The first has to do with the loaves or breads.  
> Many have seen the word as insignificant to the passage. The RSV  
> for example leaves ARTOUS out of the English translation  
> completely. The KJV includes the word but drops the definite  
> article in translation (not an uncommon practice for translators).   
> Manuscript Evidence strongly supports the text below including the  
> loaves accompanied by the definite article. Some would say that the  
> loaves are critical to the text as they indicate some sort of  
> ritual perhaps a Eucharist. I am interested in comments on  the  
> text of these two verses
>
> Mark 7:2
>
> KAI  IDONTES  TINAS TWN  MAQHTWN  AUTOU  hOTI  KOINAIS  CERSIN   
> TOUT  ESTIN
>
> And seeing some of the disciples of him that with  common    
> hands                 (this is
>
> ANIPTOIS  ESQIOUSIN  TOUS  ARTOUS
>
> unwashed) they eat the loaves

Of course we're not discussing translation as such here, but I'd say  
I think that TOUS in TOUS ARTOUS is properly omitted: the sense is  
"they eat bread" --the bread is generic; it's not particular loaves  
being referred to but "loaves" generally, for which in English we'd  
say simply "they eat bread."

On the other hand, I am indeed disturbed by the omission of "bread"  
altogether in a version of this text because I think there is a  
recurring leitmotiv
of "loaves" or "bread" and "crumbs" or "baskets of crumbs" throughout  
these chapters, including the passages where the disciples forget to  
bring
"broad" aboard when they set sail and complain that they have "only  
one loaf" or "no bread at all." I have my own discussion of this in  
my Brief Commentary" (http:www.ioa.com/`cwconradMark/) -- but i won't  
discuss it further here inasmuch as it's not so much a Greek text  
issue as a matter
of literary criticism. But I do think that all the words indicating  
something to do with "bread" ought to be clearly noted in  
translations because to omit
them is to exclude something that the evangelist surely included  
deliberately.

> The second issue has to do with the use of PUGMHi to describe the  
> washing. Traditionally in the Greek language the word is used in  
> two ways: First and foremost as “boxing” and secondly as a  
> measurement from hand to elbow.  I am sure that the usage broadened  
> over time as with all languages.  It seems to me that understanding  
> these verses is critical to understanding the narrative of this  
> unique encounter.
>
> Mark 7:3
>
> hOI GAR FARISAIOI KAI PANTES hOI IOUDAIOI EAN MH PUGMHi NIYWNTAI  
> TAS CEIRAS
>
> for the Pharisees and all the Jews unless with the fists they wash  
> the hands
>
> OUK  ESQIOUSIN  KRATOUNTES  THN  PARADOSIN  TWN  PRESBUTERWN
>
> eat not holding the tradition of the elders

There's some question about the exact intended sense of PUGMHi. There  
are pretty good notes
on this in L&N and in BDAG. My guess (and I doubt that we can do much  
more than guess about
this) is that what's intended is to indicate the painstaking concern  
of the Pharisees -- as Mark
portrays them -- in strict observance of the kosher regulations.

> a personal note is there a way to receive your own posts on this  
> list? I never see what I have posted.

As I've already noted in an off-list note: this is a matter of  
settings. Unless your BG personal settings
are set at "nomail," you should receive every message (or digests  
including every message) distributed
to list-members, including your own. But there's an option to get  
immediate copies back of your own
posts -- or I can fix that for you. You do at at the list-information  
page (you have to sign in and use
your password -- if you don't know it, you can get it by return e- 
mail, and this will take you to your
personal settings page where you can adjust matters to your own liking).

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/




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