[compost_tea] Re: When to add amendments to the soil

From: Tim Wilson <thegoodjob_at_hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 17:59:03 -0000

Hi Erica,

I have nothing against getting typical soil tests and there is some merit t=
o testing your soil, however most lab tests only reveal those nutrients whi=
ch are available (or in ionic form) but do not reveal organic nutrients whi=
ch are sequestered in organic matter/compost. Testing your level of organic=
 matter may be of greatest value.

As Stephen has mentioned there is value in adding minerals (in the form of =
rock/clay powders) to soil and compost but these are released slowly by mic=
robial and root acidifiers over a a period of time, which is (IMO) dictated=
 by the needs of the plant in a biologically balanced soil.

Besides the rock/clay powders which are available at pennies per cubic foot=
 of use (extrapolated over the years they last), well made (vermi)compost i=
s indeed in my opinion all you really need to grow a successful natural veg=
etable garden. This can be further supplemented with applications of fish h=
ydrolysates and ACT & EM fermentations to boost the microbial population if=
 the grower wishes (especially in chemical conversion to organic) but I see=
 no need to spend large sums on prepared 'organic' fertilizers. If fertiliz=
ers are truly 'organic' there should be extremely minimal danger of them le=
aching from over-watering. If you look at the NPK rating of compost and cer=
tain other organic amendments compared to chemical fertilizers you'll see t=
he numbers are much lower for the organics. This is because the nutrients a=
re sequestered and are just not testable with typical procedures (& anti-le=
achable [sic]).

Natural or organic growing should be cheap, especially considered over the =
years as your soil becomes more alive. There is really no need to sock the =
prepared fertilizers to your garden year after year.

This is really the crux of microbial based horticulture. There is no afford=
able nutrient test that will show what is organically available in your soi=
l. Rather, the very affordable microscopic examination will reveal if there=
 are the microbial players needed in your soli to release nutrients. Again,=
 this depends on some organic matter in the soil to feed the microbes. The =
players you wish to see are bacteria/archaea and the predators protozoa (fl=
agellates & naked amoebae) and/or bacterial feeding nematodes and a variety=
 of fungal hyphae including mychorhizal species as well as fungi imperfecti=
 (that which predominantly grows in (vermi)compost).

As Elaine and Jeff have so eloquently stated on numerous occasions, if one =
took a typical laboratory nutrient test from the floor of an old growth for=
est, it would show pretty much diddly-squat, however the growth which occur=
s over a single season out weighs by far many many corn, soy or wheat field=
s. Why?

After initial applications of some rock/clay powders, we produced all of ou=
r own amendments/(vermi)compost on farm for commercial sales of flowers and=
 herbs and for our own food consumption.

Salutations,
Tim

--- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, EAReinheimer <erica_r_at_...> wrote:
>
> The first question is what nutrients does your soil require?
> Although lab tests are not always accurate, they are the best we have. =
 
> I suggest Logan Labs.
>
> Then, you need to figure out what to do with the results. I suggest M.
> Astera's book, The Ideal Soil.
>
> You can add compost all you want, but if your compost lacks the elements=
 
> needed to balance your soil, you'll never get the nutrients you want.
>
> Then, add the amendments you need. The easiest way is usually the best
> - till in organic fertilizers before planting. Be careful of
> overwatering - you'll likely leach the amendments you have added.
>
> You really need to be careful when adding organic fertilizers - more is
> not better. You need to figure out exactly what you need, then add the
> exact amounts calculated, then re-test next year. I love using foliage
> kelp for micronutrients.
>
> IMHO the best bet on biologically activating your soil is after the
> minerals are already in place.
>
> My organic fertilizer bill runs about $400 per year for a 3000 sq ft
> vegetable garden. I am glad to pay it. It's a bargain. If you want
> the best nutrition from your vegetables, you need to be sure the soil is=
 
> the best it can be. Good food is healing.
>
> Erica
>
> On 6/4/2011 8:24 AM, Stephen Steyn wrote:
> >
> > Ian;
> >
> > P and K are not micro nutrients. Plants (and animals) require these
> > nutrient elements in larger quantities. As these elements are already
> > in your soils (in all likelihood), your biological additions should
> > make these more accessible to your plants over a period of time.
> > I.e.: Once your soils are biologically more active. Chicken manure is=
 
> > a source you could consider, but if you're a composter, then you
> > should be composting it, or composting it and using it in your worm
> > bins. The other products can be added to compost too but many of them
> > can for ease of work be added straight to the field. For example soft
> > rock phosphate, although more soluble that rock phosphate, is still
> > not very soluble. So you would need a large quantity and adding it to
> > your compost would make your turner work so much harder for little
> > added benefit. Feather meal, bone meal, blood meal, fish waste
> > products are good sources of phosphates but are too expensive for
> > broad scale farming unless you're organic. Cotton seed and soya
> > oilcakes are way too expensive, and are best fed to your livestock
> > (Assuming you have) rather than tossed on the soil or compost heap --
> > unless you are making compost to be used as ACT where it may have a pla=
ce.
> >
> > Lime is a slow working amendment and is dependent on microbial action
> > as well as acidic conditions for release. Gypsum is a better calcium
> > source given its solubility, but has no effect on pH if your soils
> > require that correction. It's usually used in soils that have higher
> > pH. The reason it has no effect on pH is because it contains lots of
> > Sulphur. So if your soils are low in S and Ca, then it's a good
> > choice. Also if you have a high Na problem, it will help to correct tha=
t.
> >
> > Phosphates at planting to bind sandy soil is a new one on me. Maybe
> > you mean Magnesium. Magnesium should only be added to soils if you
> > need them as they tighten your soils and make working them more difficu=
lt.
> >
> > Potassium is good during the season if your plant assay shows your
> > plants to be deficient. Then a foliar application is very effective.
> > Especially if you have high Na as the Na and K (Potassium) ions are of=
 
> > similar size (adjacent on the periodic table) and plants tend to take
> > up Na instead of K even in high testing K soils if Na is high.
> >
> > As you can see, the subject is rather more complex than imagined at
> > first blush. Giving blanket recommendations based on the vague
> > information you have supplied would more than likely cause more
> > confusion than anything else. Your best bet is to use the services of
> > an agronomist or plant scientist to apply required amendments and then=
 
> > to discuss your biological ideas with them. There must be lots in Zim,=
 
> > or in SA.
> >
> > SS
> >
> > *From:*compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *RTS Friction -
> > Carruthers
> > *Sent:* 02 June 2011 13:49
> > *To:* ECO Compost tea
> > *Subject:* [compost_tea] When to add ammendments to the soil
> >
> > Hi all this is slightly off group topic but in the range of what we
> > generally try to emulate, there are so many well educated folk on this=
 
> > group so am taking the opportunity to glean some of your experiences.
> >
> > As most of us know, similarly to compost, vermicast is lacking in
> > phosphates & potassium (important additions required for optimum plant=
 
> > growth). For gardening when is the best time to add these trace
> > elements. I'm referring to amendments such as blood & bone meal, dry
> > fish, rock phosphate, ash, chicken manure, feather meal, cotton seed &=
 
> > Soya cake etc.
> >
> > 1) Include steadily in the worm feed from the start
> >
> > 2) Mix into the VC prior to use/application
> >
> > 3) Mix in directly to the soil before VC application (how long before
> > planting)
> >
> > 4) Or apply weekly in the watering/top dressing
> >
> > At present I lime directly two weeks before planting, am led to
> > believe lime additions directly to Compost can lead to Ammonia (N)
> > losses. Presume this would have the same effect in VC, unless of
> > course the pH is low and adjustments need to be made. I add phosphates=
 
> > at planting to bind my sandy soil and reduce N losses.
> >
> > I add potassium half way through the growing period to boost flowering=
 
> > & fruiting. Am I on the right track?
> >
> > The conclusive answers to these questions I've failed to find on the
> > net, look forward to any advice on this.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Ian C
> >
> >
>




Received on Tue Jun 14 2011 - 16:04:48 EDT

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