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Ramanuja List Archive: Message 00068 Jan 2006

 
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Swamin,
 
These are some of thughts collected from different kalakshepams.
 
1. Iskon, initiates every one into vaishnavism, though a different form. They do this as initiation to vaishnavism. I dont think they make evrybody brahmins. Again though this we can say is a western concept, is actually a process started by our own emperumanar even.
 
Only difference is the initiation of women which is purely a retrogade step and they will learn by themselves.
 
2. Even bagwan says " Sarva dharman parityajya....." Swami Desikan says "Anyatha saranam nasti ....." . As longas any sould surrenders to him and him alone we have to welcome that. Mukur swami use to tell 'My lord carries the padam of the beloved on his head". This we have to celebrate the lord in them as he would like to handle them solely and follow them.
 
3. As for as the Thiruman and the Gopi goes, before thiruman during the times of ram and Krsna they wore only sandal on their heads. This was taught to me by one SESHADRI swami during my pratmic class.
 
4. Yes we have to save our culture as it explains the travails of the sould from the Jada jivan to this level. This way of living and culture needs to be preserved by explaining the significance of each of our rituals as that alsone can make our sampradayam sustain.
 
PLS DO CORRECT IF I AM WRONG PARTLY OR FULLY.
 
DASAN/raghavan

vimalkumar ranganathan <panardasan@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
 
SrI:
Dear Sri Mohan Swamin,
                                    Whilst your points are indeed effective, I would like to ramble a couple of my thoughts, as somebody who had been deeply attached to ISKCON in the past:
 
1) When it is accepted that becoming a Vaishnava is paramount and not the varna-affiliation, I am not able to reconcile with the fact that ISKCON gives "brahmana initiation" to all and sundry (including Women!!!) which has no prior vedic pramanas, even in our Sampradayam, our AchAryAs never tampered with the varna system, granted they made it a strong point that being a Srivaishnava is more important. Brahmana initiation for ladies and ladies chanting Gayathri in ISKCON - I don't know if it is western influence, or implicitly vEdic. I would love to be corrected on this regard.
 
2) Worse, many of our "Iyengars" take "initiation" from western-born SwAmis and Goswamis of ISKCON - thus symbolically relegating all their responsibilities to our Ramanuja Matham, sporting the Gopi Chandanam which is different from Sri Vaishnava sampradayam. Worse, I know of so-called SrivaishnavAs who sport fantastic thirumaN during socio-religious occasions but immediately revert to the Gopi-Chandanam at home - which reflects the pitiable condition of our sampradayam. Also, I can't understand the logic beyond young unmarried males/females from Srivaishnava families being "initiated" in ISKCON, thus accepting Gaudiya Sampradayam. I once asked a very nice ISKCON sannyasi about the same - if they respect Srivaishnavism so much, why should they initiate disciples from SV, instead of just asking them to just follow the Srivaishnava Matham? His answer was, disciples even from Srivaishnava families unconditionally surrender to Him explaining their lack of interest in SV, he initiates them only then. I couldn't doubt Him.  
 
3) Granted, there are many positively influential points in ISKCON that we learn from - food-style, commitment, etc. Unfortunately we are losing many of our brethen - young and old alike to a different sampradayam with philosophies and practices orthogonal to ours.  
 
Dasan,
Kidambi Soundararajan.  


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